Official Forums for the Ultimate Economy Game



Jump to:  
Search for:
The Simunomics Forums require separate registration from the game itself. However, forums and chat use the same registration.

It is currently Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:43 pm (All times are UTC [ DST ])




Reply to topic  [ 88 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:11 am 
Developer

Joined: Feb 8, 2008
Posts: 2888
Offline
User avatarCommit to Excellence
Bellerive Chamber of Commerce
Please use this thread for discussion of the changes to Wholesale selling (Invoice and Market). Comments outside this thread are less likely to be read and other threads may be deleted / merged as appropriate.

Positive and Negative feedback are both welcome, as well as suggestions, bug reports, exploits, and any other issues.

_________________
"Please let me make my own mistakes? 'cause I really like to learn stuff." --Wise words from Hillside Cottage

Please read the rules. Have information? Why not write a guide?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 7:21 am 

Joined: Nov 29, 2014
Posts: 33
Offline
User avatarUbermacht Ltd
Bug Swatter
You should remove the price limit. I see that you want to minimise the cash transfer but you are just ruining it for the manufacturer. Plus you are also setting the price for non-retailable product and because of that the player demand has no impact on the price.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:24 am 

Joined: Dec 14, 2014
Posts: 33
Offline
User avatarSoap & Water
Farmer
Just tried to buy a product of market price 500 and rebranded it - cost in WH now 512, but I can only sell it at 500 - OMG

No pricelimit - this does not work for any manufacture and wholesale.

This new setup does not support TG trading at all.

FIX it fast.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 9:14 am 
Developer

Joined: Feb 8, 2008
Posts: 2046
Location: Climbing up the shoulders of giants
Offline
User avatarAllmart
System Company
Ubermacht wrote:
You should remove the price limit. I see that you want to minimise the cash transfer but you are just ruining it for the manufacturer. Plus you are also setting the price for non-retailable product and because of that the player demand has no impact on the price.

Give me the scenario - product, city, building sizes - where you can't make a profit as a manufacturer.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 9:16 am 
Developer

Joined: Feb 8, 2008
Posts: 2046
Location: Climbing up the shoulders of giants
Offline
User avatarAllmart
System Company
johans75 wrote:
Just tried to buy a product of market price 500 and rebranded it - cost in WH now 512, but I can only sell it at 500 - OMG

No pricelimit - this does not work for any manufacture and wholesale.

This new setup does not support TG trading at all.

FIX it fast.

There's something to be said for rebranding. But I feel like you're leaving some information out. You're trying to sell it back to the same person you bought from, aren't you?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 12:21 pm 

Joined: Dec 14, 2014
Posts: 33
Offline
User avatarSoap & Water
Farmer
Amarsir wrote:
johans75 wrote:
Just tried to buy a product of market price 500 and rebranded it - cost in WH now 512, but I can only sell it at 500 - OMG

No pricelimit - this does not work for any manufacture and wholesale.

This new setup does not support TG trading at all.

FIX it fast.

There's something to be said for rebranding. But I feel like you're leaving some information out. You're trying to sell it back to the same person you bought from, aren't you?


Scenario:
I buy for 500 a products Market or Invoiced - I rebranded it and invoice to many people incl. the person it came from, but can still only sell it at 500, even though that WH price is now 512 - as system is calcutating I never bought it before and that my price was 500.

So now I cannot decide what I want to sell but the system does - that was not the idea for playing this game.

But my opinion - Free market - you are slowing everything DOWN. In real life, markets set the price and consumer, this restriction is the worst idea ever - NOT one person has any good thing to say about it, I would reroll update!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 12:25 pm 

Joined: Nov 29, 2014
Posts: 33
Offline
User avatarUbermacht Ltd
Bug Swatter
johans75 wrote:
Amarsir wrote:
johans75 wrote:
Just tried to buy a product of market price 500 and rebranded it - cost in WH now 512, but I can only sell it at 500 - OMG

No pricelimit - this does not work for any manufacture and wholesale.

This new setup does not support TG trading at all.

FIX it fast.

There's something to be said for rebranding. But I feel like you're leaving some information out. You're trying to sell it back to the same person you bought from, aren't you?


Scenario:
I buy for 500 a products Market or Invoiced - I rebranded it and invoice to many people incl. the person it came from, but can still only sell it at 500, even though that WH price is now 512 - as system is calcutating I never bought it before and that my price was 500.

So now I cannot decide what I want to sell but the system does - that was not the idea for playing this game.

But my opinion - Free market - you are slowing everything DOWN. In real life, markets set the price and consumer, this restriction is the worst idea ever - NOT one person has any good thing to say about it, I would reroll update!
Right and the competition will be shitty if everyone is selling at the lowest price possible I mean why should thw consumer buy mine instead of the other person with the same qa and same price.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 12:35 pm 

Joined: Dec 14, 2014
Posts: 33
Offline
User avatarSoap & Water
Farmer
Ubermacht wrote:
Amarsir wrote:
johans75 wrote:
Just tried to buy a product of market price 500 and rebranded it - cost in WH now 512, but I can only sell it at 500 - OMG

No pricelimit - this does not work for any manufacture and wholesale.

This new setup does not support TG trading at all.

FIX it fast.

There's something to be said for rebranding. But I feel like you're leaving some information out. You're trying to sell it back to the same person you bought from, aren't you?


Scenario:
I buy for 500 a products Market or Invoiced - I rebranded it and invoice to many people incl. the person it came from, but can still only sell it at 500, even though that WH price is now 512 - as system is calcutating I never bought it before and that my price was 500.

So now I cannot decide what I want to sell but the system does - that was not the idea for playing this game.

But my opinion - Free market - you are slowing everything DOWN. In real life, markets set the price and consumer, this restriction is the worst idea ever - NOT one person has any good thing to say about it, I would reroll update!
Right and the competition will be shitty if everyone is selling at the lowest price possible I mean why should thw consumer buy mine instead of the other person with the same qa and same price.[/quote]

Correct!!!!

Ex 2.

Product X - manufacturecost: 3000, market/invoice price that I can sell it for: 3200-8500 - Retailprice: 250000, guess this game just got Single player writen all over it now.

Just getting more fraustration looking at this!!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 12:35 pm 

Joined: Jul 30, 2013
Posts: 608
Offline
User avatarRonak Holdings I
 
This system, discourages re-selling.
Even though re-selling is frowned upon by many in this game, smaller players during events, or in general can make quite a cut by re-selling their allmart products.
Also, limits haven't been put on retailers, but on wholesalers, mostly who are manufacturers, or farmers. This will drive people away from the core business of the game.
Already, there are too many retailers and not enough producers.

Also, I feel, that the price limits have an element of the phil price effect in them. I mean c'mon PHIL goes by the minimum stuff. A standard 100 sqft factory with 100% ideal conditions, (no speed research etc.etc.)
The AVERAGE size of active factories, farms for players isnt 100 sqft anymore.
Please correct me if i am wrong.

Also can you give a more detailed insight on how the limits are set for wholesaling and, what statistics of history are used?
Thanks
Roni


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 1:36 pm 
EcoSim Editor

Joined: Jan 19, 2011
Posts: 4623
Offline
User avatarAindala Holdings
Bottled Water Genius
The interface...

The clicking necessary to make a sale has increased, and when selling in the market we don't get to see the current market listings.
The background image doesn't seem a very fortunate choice, it makes the whole thing look a bit messy.
The black-orange colour scheme is not my favourite, and it doesn't seem to match any of styles we have in place.

On the substance of it, I liked being able to post my Bottled Water at 1000 :beta: . I can't do that anymore, but since that Bottled Water wasn't selling anyway I'm not concerned.

johans75 wrote:
Scenario:
I buy for 500 a products Market or Invoiced - I rebranded it and invoice to many people incl. the person it came from, but can still only sell it at 500, even though that WH price is now 512 - as system is calcutating I never bought it before and that my price was 500.

Interesting... Because I tried to do just that and it's working for me.

Quote:
But my opinion - Free market - you are slowing everything DOWN. In real life, markets set the price and consumer, this restriction is the worst idea ever - NOT one person has any good thing to say about it, I would reroll update!

I don't have anything bad to say about it. Only the interface. I think it's still too early to know if this update is working or not (for the wholesale part)

_________________
Reporter and co-founder of                                               Founder of
Image                                                 Image
Send your company's statement or press release to us!
Give yourself some exposure for your company!

“If I owe you a pound, I have a problem; but if I owe you a million, the problem is yours.”
J. M. Keynes


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:00 pm 
Developer

Joined: Feb 8, 2008
Posts: 2046
Location: Climbing up the shoulders of giants
Offline
User avatarAllmart
System Company
johans75 wrote:
There's something to be said for rebranding. But I feel like you're leaving some information out. You're trying to sell it back to the same person you bought from, aren't you?


Scenario:
I buy for 500 a products Market or Invoiced - I rebranded it and invoice to many people incl. the person it came from, but can still only sell it at 500, even though that WH price is now 512 - as system is calcutating I never bought it before and that my price was 500.[/quote]
The only time the system should lock you into a single price is when you are reselling - by invoice - to the same person you bought from. Every other time you may be centered around that price but still have a range. If you sell to the market you'll have a very wide range in fact. If this is not true please provide a screenshot so we can see.

That said you have a good point about rebranding. We should have an update by end of day that will take rebranding into account to give you more options.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:03 pm 
Developer

Joined: Feb 8, 2008
Posts: 2046
Location: Climbing up the shoulders of giants
Offline
User avatarAllmart
System Company
johans75 wrote:
Ex 2.

Product X - manufacturecost: 3000, market/invoice price that I can sell it for: 3200-8500

You're saying you can sell it for 2.5 times what it costs you to make, and you're complaining about that? That just goes to show how much you guys have completely warped the market. If you didn't all skip over levels 1-10 you might know what a real profit rate looks like.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:08 pm 
EcoSim Editor

Joined: Jan 19, 2011
Posts: 4623
Offline
User avatarAindala Holdings
Bottled Water Genius
.


Last edited by Aindala on Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:25 pm 

Joined: Dec 14, 2014
Posts: 33
Offline
User avatarSoap & Water
Farmer
The point of FREE MARKET is that there is no pricelimit - not in real life and so there should not be here either.

And 2.5xtimes profit is nothing - IRL - look at microsoft - profit per unit 300x. - It all depend on quality.(Or people call it :))

So stop trying to control the way markets flow.

Still think that this update cannot be saved, is just the idea in generel go against what we are trying to simulate.



Ex.

Let say you are trying to sell your car at 30K - but someone tells you, that you cannot sell it at more than 20K (Because goverment told you so.) - NIET


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:36 pm 
Developer

Joined: Feb 8, 2008
Posts: 2046
Location: Climbing up the shoulders of giants
Offline
User avatarAllmart
System Company
ronak1996 wrote:
Also, limits haven't been put on retailers, but on wholesalers, mostly who are manufacturers, or farmers. This will drive people away from the core business of the game.
Already, there are too many retailers and not enough producers.

Retailers are already limited. You could never pick any price and any quantity for retail. If you charged too much it wouldn't sell. But wholesale was a free-for-all. And people proved they couldn't be trusted.

If you ever want a stock market EVER, this has to happen. That or we kick out all free accounts and make the game pay to play. Because I simply can't have one of us staring at trades 6 hours a day to catch the cheaters who just don't stop no matter how many times we catch them.

Then there's the gang mentality. The bullying other players to fall in line and calling them "leeches" for not using the price rules a couple players decided on. If people are going to be forced to live under rules then it might as well be our rules.

And on top of it, you hadn't even sustained a good economy. Canjara crashed so hard and is only now starting to level out in population. And that 80% retail economy can't be too rewarding. Retailers might have circumvented by using 7-day dumping tricks, but those loopholes are closing too.

But I do not believe - at all - that it's skewed to retailers. You could start a brand new company right now, making q0 glass with q0 silica and oil bought right off the market, selling your glass with the slider, and double your company within 3 days. THREE DAYS That's without sweetheart deals, without retailing, without quality inputs, without tickets, without any complications.

Of course people who skipped to level 12 on the first day wouldn't appreciate that. But players when the game was newer, who took 2 weeks with ideal strategy to hit level 2 if they did everything right? They'd know.

ronak1996 wrote:
The AVERAGE size of active factories, farms for players isnt 100 sqft anymore.

Right. And the average quality isn't 0 anymore. Which means the average price isn't PHIL anymore.

Look at this graph from the headline:

Image

First, you can easily see that your price range goes up as the quality appeal does. Since your buildings are bigger than 100ft then you should have access to more quality. So if you can make qa100 then you aren't limited to PHIL prices. You're limited to 9x PHIL prices. Which is not so limiting after all.

Also I can't help but notice that the people with the most expensive sourcing - qa200-250 - had no problem fitting right in the center of the band. And a lot of people at the low end had no problem either. But some right in the middle felt they needed to have the highest prices around and I'm at a loss to see why that should be.

Maybe running a profitable business isn't as easy as they think. And maybe that's exactly why we want this to challenge them.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 88 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

It is currently Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:43 pm (All times are UTC [ DST ])


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group